tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post2389927923236791189..comments2023-09-17T07:13:54.045-06:00Comments on Drunken Samurai Painting Blog: What is Wrong With Game's Workshop?Roberthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01446782807978825841noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-90520989329094785332011-08-14T01:14:55.627-06:002011-08-14T01:14:55.627-06:00Rob,
Very well written...
Not to sound like a ye...Rob, <br />Very well written...<br /><br />Not to sound like a yes man here but I do agree with you on almost all points.Lonnie Jordanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15798611886305297603noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-9299881395331470722011-08-10T23:22:32.947-06:002011-08-10T23:22:32.947-06:00Wasn't it in last year's end-of-the-year f...Wasn't it in last year's end-of-the-year financial report that Tom Kirby (Mark Wells?) said that Games Workshop was a company that produced miniatures, first and foremost? <br /><br />My memory is a little foggy about the exact wording of that bit in the report, but the slap in the face to all their loyal GAMING customers was there, plain as day.<br /><br />I've been seeing the same exodus (though, to be fair, "exodus" might be a bit grand of a term right now) of players going to other systems round my area as well--more with 40k than with WFB.<br /><br />It's creepy right now how lcoal tournaments over sell their Warhammer spots and have a harder time filling their 40k spots. A friend of mine was lamenting his finishing his 2,000-point Tyranid army as no one he like playing with now plays 40k: they've all moved on to Warhammer 8th, War Machine or Flames of War.<br /><br />The interesting bit with WFB 8th Edition is that sales of models are still just as stagnant as they've always been the last few years (I worked in a game store, so my finger was very much on the pulse, and the only thing Warhammer could say to feel good about itself was that at least it wasn't Lord of the Rings).<br /><br />I think GW has been slowly losing customers--almost imperceptibly--over the last few years, but this year's price increase, coupled with the monthly price rises a-la FineCast[TM] has been doing much to make other games feel a tad more palatable.Imaginary Warshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15797043977686087064noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-94873132862984642011-08-03T10:24:38.742-06:002011-08-03T10:24:38.742-06:00Here is my perspective, not to disagree/agree, mor...Here is my perspective, not to disagree/agree, more of an addendum. This is a direction I think GW is trying to go.<br />The creation of IP ( intellectual property, i.e. fluff ), which they can then sell to other companies, which will then lead to new players. The miniatures and rules are just advertising this IP. With the exception being LoTR, for which they have much less control ( ok, none essentially) over the IP. I believe this to really be one of the driving forces behind GW's lawyers shutting down so many websites a couple of years ago. GW thinks the sale of IP to be a great way to increase income, not only through miniature sales to vets but will get NEW players interested who are GW real targets. IMHO we have already seen this with Dawn of War, the space marine movie etc. Just look at what the HALO universe has done for Bungie/Microsoft. Imagine if this new kill team game takes off, how many people will begin to get interested in the 40K universe, then discover Fantasy and maybe, maybe LoTR. <br />Sorry if this is a bit fragmented my head is killing me.Jobuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04590832576876653676noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-30115618374821268452011-08-03T05:40:56.504-06:002011-08-03T05:40:56.504-06:00Couldn't agree with you more, I was hooked by ...Couldn't agree with you more, I was hooked by the models and lost by the rules 8th ed Fantasy to be exact. Lucky for GW I moved to 40k.Vitorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15629180464132473487noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-74084839692175246592011-08-02T22:22:48.877-06:002011-08-02T22:22:48.877-06:00After 22 years, I have moved on. And while this is...After 22 years, I have moved on. And while this is a common number of years for the grizzled gamer, bear in mind I started GW when I was 8 years old. This is something I grew up with as a child, played with as a teenager, and played competitively as an adult. <br /><br />I have owned and painted more armies for 40k than I can remember. I have played every edition of 40k, and half of the Fantasy editions. I have endured every price hike. Necromunda, Gorka Morka, Blood Bowl, Mordheim, Gothic, Inquisitor.. I've played them all. I have put a paintbrush to a model nearly every day for the last 22 years.<br /><br />And in recent months, it just seems to be one thing after another from this company. I can't stick up for them anymore. I really can't justify their prices or attitude for their customers. It's like we should be ever so greatful for being spit on with sloppy rules, zero tournament support, miscasts and insane pricing. It really boggles me as to why I would want to support a company that not only thinks I'm an idiot, but will treat me like one too.<br /><br />So I like many local gamers have moved on to Privateer Press. If I want to check out a new faction, I don't have to drop several hundreds of dollars on it. The rules are clean and clear with little room for "friendly debates". There is a standard tournament format that most organizers use (so there are no surprises or guessing how a tournament will be judged). PP also shows up in force to any major event or convention. That isn't something GW does. How many GW employees are at adepticon? gencon? etc? few, if any at all.<br /><br />On one hand, it feels like losing an old friend (and that is only because I've been a customer for most of my life). But on the other, it feels like breaking up with an abusive spouse.Mundarhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13223875200690867654noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-56890380163452398532011-08-02T22:10:33.250-06:002011-08-02T22:10:33.250-06:00Very good point. They don't seem to bother pro...Very good point. They don't seem to bother proofing nor writing the rules clear enough that there aren't three different interpretations for everything. <br /><br />I want quality in fluff, rules, and miniatures. Some can do without quality some of those, but I can't. I agree that GW is having issues as they aren't liked by their customers. Big issue indeed.Flekkzohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14508641232973488303noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-53293691669334038022011-08-02T18:37:56.146-06:002011-08-02T18:37:56.146-06:00Ever since the success of the 4th Edition Warhamme...Ever since the success of the 4th Edition Warhammer and 2nd Edition 40,000 and things like Necromunda to a lesser extent. The rules have existed to sell the game. The competitive tournament player is a small minority. The people who only play with fully painted minis is a small minority. A lot of people buy stuff, put it together, play with it for a while and get bored and move on. These people and more especially their mothers is who GW markets too in their retail stores. Some of them are like daycares. The movies and video games have brought in new older players, but I think the people who buy the most product are the kids and the wealthy dudes that pay other people to paint their models, people with little golden daemon trophies for instance. ;-) The person who does it all themselves and sticks with the same models/army etc for a decade or so are not GW's preferred customers. They want people to buy the flavor of the month. That is why the codices seem to get better as an edition goes on, that is why they make another Space Marine chapter, space marines sell, people always say I'm never going to collect another space marine army, then they do... So many used space marine models are out there, but GW keeps making fancier and fancier new releases, even the FineCast is an example of that. Sure I have that model, but I don't have it in ultra detailed resin...<br /><br />I'm too old and too slow and generally too busy real world issues to worry much anymore. I slowly fill up my display cases with models I rarely game with, people are starting to get desperate to lure me to events and game nights. I just have bigger issues right now, so the models sit there, I can see a couple 100 painted models from here, they were too much work for me to ever sell. No idea what I'll do with them if I ever die or get married and can't have a miniature collection take up a wall in my apartment. ;-)Muskiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10328467370627934582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-45951307115518706372011-08-02T17:32:54.637-06:002011-08-02T17:32:54.637-06:00A great post with many points I agree with. In ter...A great post with many points I agree with. In terms of the collector and painter, but gamer too... what frustrated me was, you gradually bought an army, started painting and playing with it, asways looking forward to it being fully painted and looking splendid on table top when finished, but while you painted it... they change the rules and codexes, and dump half the units from the game.... Stuff it I thought... I'd bought squats and they never made it to the rules officially (this really pissed me off - a lot of time and money spent for nothing), I stayed loyal and switched to Orks, got them almost done and they changed the rules and my savage boar boys dissappeared over night... Same with aspects of WFB. I'm done with it, never again. Shame is I see my young boy growing up, looking at my old models and in the window of GW, but I won't be buying any for him nor encouraging him, except for LOTR, but FinecOst may have put paid to that too now...Scottswargaminghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00581220877007982139noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-83375829991067957802011-08-02T13:18:20.255-06:002011-08-02T13:18:20.255-06:00To quote your words above "It was the models ...To quote your words above <i>"It was the models that got me hooked but the rules that lost me."</i>... that is so true of me and my whole gaming group. <br /><br />We started playing WFB over 20 years ago, then it was WH40k & Epic. But we all found the rules less inspiring than the models. And the regular release no new rules editions that left models obsolete eventually drove us away. <br /><br />I don't play GW games any more. I still buy their models occasionally, but not in the quantities I would If I played a particular game system. My hard earned cash [and that of my mates] has moved elsewhere.BigLeehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00960213980906190335noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-41928485787479361292011-08-02T12:15:21.491-06:002011-08-02T12:15:21.491-06:00I think that price is an important part of the iss...I think that price is an important part of the issue but not the most important. I believe that MOST GW customers will deal with the price as long as they are getting an excellent product and GW agrees. The porblem is they don't see the rules as a product worthy of the same quality focus. THis is hurting their business WAY more than any price increase.Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01446782807978825841noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-45712047875673062062011-08-02T11:24:18.277-06:002011-08-02T11:24:18.277-06:00People have been complaining about GW for years, b...People have been complaining about GW for years, but this is the first time I've seen people take action. Dakka is full of posts from people moving to anyone of a dozen games.<br /><br />GW does have an obsession with quality - it's all part of their premium pricing model. However, as you point out, the quality of their game and their figures is dropping. And GW hasn't seemed to have noticed yet.<br /><br />PS - It's amazing how polarizing 8th ed WFB is - I'm in the "can't stand it" camp & don't see how anyone could be so excited by the changes.Chicago Terrain Factoryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13120517237019460964noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3058258817691018841.post-58458944075940209682011-08-02T11:16:02.274-06:002011-08-02T11:16:02.274-06:00Good article, if you had a "tweet this" ...Good article, if you had a "tweet this" link, or whatever it's called, I would click it.<br /><br />I will say that for every person that says 8th edition is killing the game, there's another saying it revitalizes it. I have no idea, I play with mostly with 1 buddy so I can't comment either way.Tomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03192316280629844659noreply@blogger.com